The Rebel Faction

Register today to customize your account.
Galactic Citizen

General/TNO R&D: Executor class Star Destroyer

The following is technically an R&D submission, but a post to clear up the hazy areas surrounding the Executor-class Star Destroyer's performance and design so that those that have them (the two left in the galaxy!) can role-play with them more effectively. The numbers below are not an excuse for the owners to completely waste enemy ships or fleets. As always, common sense and not Kach Thorton's speculative R&D thread should be the basis for any of your role-plays involving the vessel in order to make threads more enjoyable for both participants and readers.

***

Huge, Powerful, and Majestic, the Executor-class Star Destroyer is considered to be one of the most spectacular and beautiful vessels ever built, even compared to the larger Eclipse-class. However, at least OOC wise, the ship is surrounded by a cloud of mystery and confusion that I intend to address myself.

The biggest and longest lasting debate involving the vessel has been on its length. Official sources, including The Essential Guide to Vessels and Vehicles claim Executor-class Star Destroyers are 8,000 meters long. However, Canon evidence says otherwise. Compared to Imperial-class Star Destroyers on screen in the last two movies, the Executor appears approximately 10 or 11 times longer, twice the size of the "Official" number.

The most widespread explanation for this- and the one both I and from what I've read, TRF, endorse- is that there are in fact two versions of the ship, the larger Executor I at 16,000 or 17,600 meters in length and the II class, of the 8,000 meter length stated by most sources.

By this explanation, the first Executors built- the twin ships Executor and Lusankya - were of the I class, and all later vessels- such as the Knight's Hammer, Guardian, and Iron Fist- were of the smaller II type.

(It should be noted that, on TRF, there is a 12,800 meter long III class that is in service with the Empire. However, to date only one has been built, Bhindi Drayson's flagship, the Acheron.)

This explanation, to me, makes sense. Vader and Isard were very powerful people in Palpatine's Empire and would both certainly merit one of the larger vessels. And with the Empire producing two of these mammoth ships and two Death Stars in just a few years, it would be a natural cost saving measure to develop a budget version for service in fleet elements such as the Black Fleet- The 8,000 meter Executor II.

For armament, Executors of both the I and II class are said to have 250 Heavy Turbolaser Cannons, 250 Heavy Turbolaser Batteries, 250 Concussion Missile Tubes, and 250 Heavy Ion Cannons by most sources, once again including the Essential Guide (it should be noted not all do- Inside the Worlds of the Star Wars trilogy gives the Executor 5,000 Turbolasers and 5,000 Ion Cannons). 1000 weapons emplacements is quite a few, yes, but for a ship that has the area of 25 ISDs (to say nothing of volume) that's nothing. Like giving an ISD ten Turbolasers and Ten Ion Cannons. The Imperial Navy has never been, and certainly wasn't then, one to be modest. Rest assured Executors of both the I and II class were armed to the teeth, and that's whey I'm sure the official armament list is incorrect. In addition, 144 fighters is nothing for a ship it's size. Therefore, below I intend to calculate what would be a more reasonable spec, basing the calculations on the three canon variants of ISD. The statistics of the ships are below...

(From the NIF RPG Database)

Name/Type: Imperator Mk I-class Star Destroyer
Designer/Manufacturer: Lira Wessex / Kuat Drive Yards
Designation: Heavy Cruiser
Crew: 26,810 + 275 Gunners
Length: 1605 meters
Speed: 60 MGLT
Hyperdrive: x2
Shield Rating: 4800 SBD
Hull Rating: 2272 RU
Weapons: 60 Taim & Bak XX-9 Heavy Turbolasers (class 5), 60 Borstel NK-7 Ion Cannons (class 3), 10 Phylon Q7 Tractor Beam Projectors (class 6), 2 Minelayers.
Fighter Complement: 6 Squadrons.
Troops: 9,700 Stormtroopers, 20 AT-ATs , 30 AT-STs, 1 Pre-fabricated Garrison Base.
Support Craft: 12 Titan-class Landing Barges, 8 Lambda-class Shuttles, 15 Stormtrooper Transports, 5 Star Wing Assault Gunboats, variable number of Skipray Blastboats, Gamma-class Assault Shuttles, deep space probes, probe droids and repair & recovery vehicles.

Name/Type: Imperator Mk II-class Star Destroyer
Designer/Manufacturer: Kuat Drive Yards
Designation: Heavy Cruiser
Crew: 36,755 + 330 Gunners
Length: 1,605 Meters
Speed: 60 MGLT
Hyperdrive: x1
Shield Rating: 5760 SBD
Hull Rating: 2953 RU (est.)
Weapons: 50 Heavy Taim & Bak Turbolaser Batteries, 50 Heavy Taim & Bak Turbolaser Cannons, 12 Borstel RH8 Laser Cannon Batteries, 2 Phylon Q7 Tractor Beam Projectors, 2 Minelayers.
Fighter Complement: 6 squadrons
Troops: 9,700 Stormtroopers
Support Craft: 5 Alpha Class XG-1 Star Wings, 15 Delta Class Dx-9 or Dx-9s Transports, 8 Lambda Class T-4a Shuttles, 12 Titan-class Landing Barges, 8 Lambda-class Shuttles, variable number of Skipray Blastboats, deep space probes, probe droids and repair & recovery vehicles, 1 Gamma Class Assault Shuttle and 1 TIE Shuttle Craft.

Name/Type: Imperator Mk III-class Star Destroyer
Designer/Manufacturer: Kuat Drive Yards
Designation: Heavy Cruiser
Crew: 36,755 + 668 Gunners
Length: 1,605 Meters
Speed: 70 MGLT
Hyperdrive: x1
Shield Rating: 6200 SBD
Hull Rating: 3000 RU
Weapons: 64 Heavy Taim & Bak Turbolaser Batteries, 64 Heavy Taim & Bak Turbolaser Cannons, 30 Heavy Ion Cannons, 64 Borstel RH8 Laser Cannon Batteries, 10 Phylon Q7 Tractor Beam Projectors, 2 Minelayers, 6 Torpedo Octet Launchers.
Fighter Complement: 6 Squadrons.
Troops: 9,700 Stormtroopers, 120 Zero-G Assault Troopers, 20 AT-ATs, 30 AT-STs, 1 Pre-fabricated Garrison Base.
Support Craft: 12 Titan-class Landing Barges, 6 Alpha-class XG-1 Star Wings, 4 GAT-12m Skipray Blastboats, 15 Delta Class Dx-9 or Dx-9s Transports , 8 Lambda Class T-4a Shuttles, 3 Gamma Class Assault Shuttles, 48 Probe Droids, 12 Combat Utility Vehicles, 2 TIE/ew and 2 TIE/fc, deep space probes, probe droids and repair & recovery vehicles, 1 Gamma Class Assault Shuttle and 1 TIE Shuttle Craft.
Modifications: Integrated Cloaking System

(Yes, I know the speeds are whacked, but other than that I find it the best database on the net).

So those are the figure's I'm going to use as I calculate the below.

Like I was saying, the armament was terribly low for a ship it's size, so...

ISD I
60 Taim & Bak XX-9 Heavy Turbolasers (x25= 1,500)
60 Borstel NK-7 Ion Cannons (x25= 1,500)
10 Phylon Q7 Tractor Beam Projectors (x25= 250)
2 Minelayers (x25= 50)

Using ISD I statistics an Executor II could have 3,300 weapons emplacements, however, the Imperial two was just entering service about the same time, so it's armament might also be used as a basis...

ISD II
50 Heavy Taim & Bak Turbolaser Batteries (x25= 1,250)
50 Heavy Taim & Bak Turbolaser Cannons (x25= 1,250)
12 Borstel RH8 Laser Cannon Batteries (x25= 300)
2 Phylon Q7 Tractor Beam Projectors (x25= 50)
2 Minelayers (x25= 50)

That gives 3,000, slightly less emplacements than an ISD one. So we can guess the Executor II would have between 3,000-3,300 weapons emplacements when first built, and the Executor I, four times the size of the II, could have between 12,000 and 13,200, quite a few more than the official lists!

Later versions, however, could also derive their number of weapons emplacements from the later Imperial III, which entered service as the cloned Emperor was building up his fleet to strike the New Republic.

64 Heavy Taim & Bak Turbolaser Batteries (x25= 1,600)
64 Heavy Taim & Bak Turbolaser Cannons (x25= 1,600)
30 Heavy Ion Cannons (x25= 750)
64 Point Defense Laser Cannons (not counted in Weapons emplacements figure, x25 = 1,600)
10 Phylon Q7 Tractor Beam Projectors (x25= 250)
2 Minelayers (x25= 50)
6 Torpedo Octet Launchers. (each made of 4 PT launchers) (6x4x25= 600)

So later Executor IIs, such as the Knight’s Hammer or Guardian, could have up to 4,850 Weapons Emplacements (Executor IIIs like the Ancheron could have twice this number, 9,700), and another 1,600 Point Defense Laser Cannons.

In addition to actual weapons emplacements, I think the figure of 144 fighters is far too low. So…

72*25 gives us 1,800 fighters for both new and old versions of the Executor II, quite a few. Plus, there’s support craft. I’m not going to stick the calculations on here, there’s too many sub-cap ships and it’d take two or three pages, but here’s what I got…

ISD I
300 Titan-class Landing Barges
200 Lambda-class Shuttles,
375 Stormtrooper Transports,
125 Star Wing Assault Gunboats,
Plus an variable number of Skipray Blastboats, Gamma Assault Shuttles, deep space probes, Probots, and Repair and Recovery vehicles.

ISD II
125 Alpha Class XG-1 Star Wings
375 Delta Class Dx-9 or Dx-9s Transports
200 Lambda Class T-4a Shuttles
300 Titan-class Landing Barges
25 Gamma Class Assault Shuttle
25 TIE Shuttle Craft.
Plus a variable number of Skipray Blastboats, deep space probes, probe droids and repair & recovery vehicles

Therefore, early versions could have carried between 800 and 1,100 shuttles. Later versions, however…

300 Titan-class Landing Barges
150 Alpha-class XG-1 Star Wings
100 GAT-12m Skipray Blastboats
375 Delta Class Dx-9 or Dx-9s Transports
200 Lambda Class T-4a Shuttles
75 Gamma Class Assault Shuttles
1200 Probe Droids (not included in shuttle figure)
300 Combat Utility Vehicles
50 TIE/ew
50 TIE/fc
25 TIE Shuttle Craft.
Plus a variable number of deep space probes and repair & recovery vehicles.

This gives later ships, such as the Knight’s Hammer a Shuttle Complement of 1,625 along with a fighter complement of 1,800.

Shields aren’t something that is commonly speculated on or debated. It’s generally agreed that they are massive and there’s no need to debate. But by scouring the Internet, I have found the following for shield and Armor ratings…

Wikipedia
Hull Plating 45712 U
Deflector Shielding 96000 U

NIF RPG Database (same place I got the ISD status above)
Shield Rating: 108000 SBD
Hull Rating: 45000 RU

I believe they are low, however. Using an ISD one’s shield and hull ratings, we get the following…

Shield Rating: 4800 SBD (x25 = 120,000 SBD)
Hull Rating: 2272 RU (x25 = 56,800)

Massive! And when ISD II and III ratings are used, the figures only grow…

Shield Rating: 5760 SBD (x25 = 144,000)
Hull Rating: 2953 RU (x25 = 73,825


Shield Rating: 6200 SBD (x25 = 155,000)
Hull Rating: 3000 RU (x25 = 75,000)

Like with armament and fighter complement, these figures would be multiplied 4 times to give the Executor I’s status, or by two to give the Executor IIIs. Dang, that’s big!

As for speed, with ten engines the size of an ISD, I could easily see the ship with twice the maximum speed. However, because that’s just plain unfair, I’d guess it’d be capable of a far more modest 2/3rds of an Imperial Star Destroyer’s Sublight speed, about 12 MGLT.

However, the Executor’s massive power comes at a steep price not only at the space-dock but also in the logistics department. 25 times the size of an ISD, it would make sense for it to also have 25 times the crew complement and troop complement (which would give 677,125 crew with the ISD one and 1,125,125 with the two model, with 242,500 Troops supported by 500 AT-ATs and 750 AT-STs), but I find these figures fantastically high for a ship only 8,000 meters long rivaling the Death Star in sheer manpower (which had only a million souls and maximum complement). A more accurate number, I believe, for the Executor II is the 280,374 crewers stated by Wikipedia with 38,000 troops (with 40 AT-ATs and 60 AT-STs) since many tasks on the smaller ships would overlap and take away a need for many crew such as those on the bridge and in fire control.

So after all that, here’s what we get…*

Executor II-class Star Destroyer
Length- 8,000m
Beam- 3,000m
Height- 850m

Complement- 280,374 Crew plus 38,000 troops (with 40 AT-ATs and 60 AT-STs)

Speed-
a. Normal- 8 MGLT
b. Flanking-12 MGLT
c. Emergency- 16MGLT
Hyperdrive- Class 2

Shields- 112,500 SBD
Hull- 56,800 RU

Fighter Complement- 1,800 Fighters and Bombers in 150 Squadrons
Other Support Craft- 1,500 Shuttles

Armament- (yes there’s 5,000 emplacements, slightly above the ISD III numbers, but I believe that with less crew there’d be more room for power generators and other do dads to allow this.) 1,500 Heavy Turbolaser Cannons, 1,500 Heavy Turbolaser Batteries, 1,500 Heavy Ion Cannon Batteries, 500 Misc. Projectile Launchers

(*Executor IIIs would have about twice this number, since they are about twice as big, and Is would have about four times)

So to make a long story short, if you own one of the two Executor-class Star Destroyers in the galaxy you are a very lucky bastard indeed.

Comments

#20 8:34pm 03/05/10

[quote]Wes, Kach, Park, Telan: You guys better come up with some damn good stories to back such a sudden appearance, particularly where it pertains to all active TNO'ers suddenly getting their very own SSD-sized ships.[/quote]

We had made mention, during Cataclysm, that TNO, over the course of the year, had constructed four new SSD IVs to either replace or complement command ships currently in service. Those that had been replaced went into mothballed reserve fleets.

#19 8:13pm 03/05/10

[QUOTE=Smarts]I feel the need to ask a question or two, such as:

How you guys went from two to six of these things in one post?

That, and why would Bhindi Drayson authorize the construction of FOUR duplicates of her personal command ship, the vessel which signified her authority within the Empire?

Or should I pay no attention to the man behind the curtain?[/QUOTE]


Worry not, yon computer spawned mortal. Yay, though I care not for statistics and neither lament the loss of nor miss the days of the Math Faction I doth care verily about sense which are common. To which end, least those involved provide a very logical background for such inclusions, this Administrator will cry foul and dispense a brand of justice most brutal.

In other words...

Wes, Kach, Park, Telan: You guys better come up with some damn good stories to back such a sudden appearance, particularly where it pertains to all active TNO'ers suddenly getting their very own SSD-sized ships.

#18 8:04pm 03/05/10

[QUOTE]However - the Conqueror-class Star Destroyer was not designed as a command ship - it is a purpose-built heavy ship of the line. [/QUOTE]Maybe not designed as one but it would make a good one.

#17 7:16pm 03/05/10

I am generally not following as I am trying to ease myself back into rping.

However - the Conqueror-class Star Destroyer was not designed as a command ship - it is a purpose-built heavy ship of the line. Her purpose is to engage the enemy main battle fleet and dispense more damage than it absorbs, which is considerable. They are built at a special yard in OverSector Outer, very very hush hush. There were six completed up to the time I disappeared - one was used in Onyx as my flag, another, the Glorious, was lost under then-Admiral Kraken, and four more were in the Fleet-proper where another was lost during the evacuation of Coruscant. That leaves four all told, only three in the galaxy proper.

Currently I use an SSD as my new flagship, the Autarch. Last time I rped, I made mention of a half-dozen SSDs in service, and that was only regular SSDs - - not counting larger command ships and personal flagships like Eclipes and whatever.

Size-wise, I have rped them 12,500 meters long. Thats what I do. I also rped them in versions, the original Executors - 8000m, then the second versions, 12,500, and larger and so on.

#16 6:38pm 03/05/10

[QUOTE]I think that Captian America would beat Batman in a fist fight.[/QUOTE]

Neither. Battlestar Galactica trumps Bears because it's gray like my soul.

#15 5:25pm 03/05/10

I feel the need to ask a question or two, such as:

How you guys went from two to six of these things in one post?

That, and why would Bhindi Drayson authorize the construction of FOUR duplicates of her personal command ship, the vessel which signified her authority within the Empire?

Or should I pay no attention to the man behind the curtain?

#14 4:47pm 03/05/10

Guns? when you say guns is that cannons? of batteries?
I come from a background of table top rpg where we used top down paper cutout minis to play. The debate over cannons vs batteries has been waged fore 30 some odd years now and will go on long after we are gone.

A battery is a mount of 5 weapons, generally speaking. So 250 batteries would work out to 1250 cannons. It really is all relative. The new RPG stats have it at 25 batteries. yes 25.

Also Size. 8km, 12.8km, 17.5km, and 19km which one to use. according to the jedi academy trilogy and the new jedi order have SSDs at 8km.

the first WEG 1989 rpg guide and the collectice card game put the SSD at 5 times the length of an imperial star destroyer. which is 8km this ship also had only 9 engines and had a larger bridge structure than the model used in the movies.

Black fleet crisis puts it at 10 times an IMp. and called it an executor class. thats 16km the 1998 interactive cd rom has both 8km and 12.8 km SSDs

then in 2004 Bam 19km.

I am looking at both copys of the starships of the galaxy now. the new saga edition has the executor at 19 km. the old WEG edition has it at 12.8 km. but the old WEG starships of the galaxy has the wepons as cannons. so 250 heavy turbolasers works out to be only 50 batteries.

I say work up a TRF verson of the SSD Mk I and go from there. I do not understand why there would be a MK III verson. unless to diferintiate the size. O mean the MK I would still be the biggest most powerful ship in the TRF galaxy, and I would think not many would be around and building new ones would be a rare ordeal.

The olny problem I have is how these ships will be played IC. They have the potential to be misused worse than any other single object in the star wars galaxy. I man a death star is expected to be Uber. So is an SSD to an extent. But I bet very few of you imperials out there want to lose one in battle. IN the 12 odd years i have been writing and role playing online only once have I seen someone let their prize SSD flagship get killed.

Now I know I am relativly new here. I have been a member for a long time but have not been active much. And the dynamics of RP here are differant than other sites. But in the end the stats do not matter. its how you write and play the game. that being said no you can not ignore the stats of something like an SSD. it really is an acception to the rule. other factions really do not have anything classed with it. yes we can use multiple ships and massed fighter attacks to kill one, but that means massive fleet engagments. What about the small a single battlegroup. a destroyer class ship and 12 escorting ships of varied class. they have no chance against an SSD. basiclly because an SSD would have at least a battlegroup escorting it. usually more.

How about the imps taking a Tempest, Venerator, or a Conqueror for a flagship. they are still very very powerful ships which out class anything other factions are bound to have. Even a Austrus or a Reign is as good if not better than the top ships of other factions. Im not saying dont have an SSD laying around to use Im am just saying dont ride it out to take on a cruiser and 2 frigates who are attacking your itty bitty planet which means nothing.

Ok I said my part. I hope it help to end this debate so we canget along with the sullust thread.

Thanx for reading
Reshmar

#13 4:32am 03/05/10

I'm going to resurrect this thread to clear some things up.

I'm no mathematician, but here's the way I see it.

We'll take the ISD V as a base. It has a surface area of 11,080 meters. It carries approximately 148 guns, not accounting for the extra size of the STLs - so let's double them and bring it to 154 guns. That's approximately one gun per 72 meters squared.

Using the same ratios for keel, beam, and mast, an 8000 meter ESD II has a surface area of 38,540 meters squared. Placing one gun per 72 meters squared (which is low, since the ESD doesn't need to use the same surface area ratio for certain systems, hanger bays, or shielding), the ESD II can carry approximately 535 guns. Given the variables, I'd say an ESD II carries approximately 600 guns.

Again using the same ratios, a 12,500 meter ESD III has a surface area of 60,218 meters squared. At one gun per 72 meters squared (which, again, is very low), the ESD III should carry at least 832 guns. Accounting for the difference in surface area, I'd argue the actual number should be somewhere around 1500 to 2000, depending on how the other systems are arranged, how much cityscape there is as opposed to guns, etc. With other tradeoffs (for example, troop quarters/troop complement, fighter complement, etc.) the number could possibly reach as high as 2500 or 3000 guns.

Personally, I think 600-800 guns for an ESD II and 1500-2000 guns for an ESD III is reasonable.

Hope this helps.

#12 2:01pm 27/08/06

an ISD III does not have more emp,acements than the IV

#11 11:52am 27/08/06

Well after looking it over, it looks fairly good, I'd just like to point out a few things: #1: No Capital Ship the size of an ISD can travel at the speed of 60-70 MGLT. At best an ISD can manage about 10 MGLT. Those ratings are preposterous.
#2: As far as starfighter squadrons are concerned, latter classes of ISD seemed to have a lot more embarked that previous classes according to some of the NJO novels, however, the Errant Venture, an ISD II, was seen to be able to accomodate 10 squadrons of starfighters, and this was due to having a larger hangar, which replaced the ground vehicles and infantry that would normally be embarked on an ISD II.
#3: As far as the SSDs are concerned, Knight Hammer I think was at least the size of the original Executor if not larger, for she not only carried significantly larger number of starfighters, but also still held an impressive array of ground troops.

And more points to come.

#10 4:59am 27/08/06

What's the IV? Isn't that an ISD II with better systems?

The reason I used the ISD in general is taht five of them fit into an Executor's length- great for conveninece, as I can stack them edge to edge to get 25.. Corise gave me a different model's stas- the databases done by you- and so I simply adopted them for convenience.

Plus, an ISD III has more emplacements than an Astrus, even if outgunned. There's just no way to express an "SLT" in that kind of count.

Uh... sure Park, beat or lecture me into submission or something.

#9 1:43am 27/08/06

Corise is correct. the Mark III is 1800m - and it is aged by Imperial standards. Ships of the Line include the Mark IV and Astrus/Imperial V with the Mark III becoming more and more of a second-rate battleship.

As for the SSD - I have no comment.

#8 10:29pm 26/08/06

I think that Captian America would beat Batman in a fist fight.

...

#7 8:59pm 26/08/06

Aw man. Looks like I'm going to have to set you straight. But that can wait until tomorrow.

#6 7:22pm 26/08/06

Speed woudl be six MGLT then... and the databank lists an ISD I's speed as 10 MGLT, so the Executor II's high in that department, I"ll have to go edit it.

However, this is not a matter of length, but a matter of area and volume. If you layed ISDs over an 8000m Executor II you could fit 25. That's where I got than number. However, at 1800 m the Imperial III would disrupt that balance, but you coudl still fit probably 23 or 24 in there (that's areawise, if volume was what was being used, you coudl stack two or three ISDs one on top of the other over the entire ship), but I'm goign to go low and use 22, so...


Armament:
60 Heavy Turbolaser Turrets (x22 = 1,320)
8 Heavy Quad-turbolaser Cannon (x22 = 176)
100 Heavy Turbolaser Cannon (casemented guns) (x22 = 2,200)
10 Ion Cannons (x22 = 220)
12 Proton Warhead Octets (96 tubes/8 per launcher) (96x22 = 2112)
10 Tractor Beam Projectors (x22 = 220)

Which gives 6,551 Weapons Emplacements.

22*96 equals 2,112 Fighters.

Shield Rating: 5,000 SBD (x22 = 110,000)
Hull Rating: 3,900 RU (x22 = 85,800 RU)

<<<123456>>>