I love sketch comedy....
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The Rebel Faction » Forums » General Discussion » Rebel Cafe » Whos God Talking to?
<b>Taj Daemun<br><i>Worship Me</b></i>
And let there be light.. dont get me wrong, but wasn't he alone at the time? I stand in my kitchen "Let there be Cheese and maccaroni!" and then I make it, becuase I like to shout out what Im about to make so I know to expect it, and then taste it afterwards "And it was good" becuase I approve of my own creation...
I love sketch comedy....
I love sketch comedy....
<b>Taj Daemun<br><i>Worship Me</b></i>
littler conversation on the lesser funny parts of the matter....
The Lord says:
question for you
FaithfuLee21 says:
k
The Lord says:
Is God prone to talking to himself?
FaithfuLee21 says:
what?
The Lord says:
Just answer
FaithfuLee21 says:
I don't think so
FaithfuLee21 says:
I think everything He says is of Great Importance
The Lord says:
Who does he tell to let light be?
FaithfuLee21 says:
it is a statement
FaithfuLee21 says:
and the angels were there then too
The Lord says:
to who?
FaithfuLee21 says:
angels came before earth and everything but God
The Lord says:
Where does it say that?
The Lord says:
In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
FaithfuLee21 says:
if you had infinite power...and all you had to do is speak to make something "be" every word you said would be important
FaithfuLee21 says:
in teh beginning of what we k w
The Lord says:
If hes God he doesnt need to speak to make it happen
FaithfuLee21 says:
lucifer fell before the creation
The Lord says:
it just does
The Lord says:
Impossible
FaithfuLee21 says:
thing is impossible with God
The Lord says:
http://www.pawcreek.org/articles/endtimes/WhenDidSatanFall.htm
FaithfuLee21 says:
lucifer BEFORE ...a heaven dweller with God
FaithfuLee21 says:
he a beautiful..in fact the MOST beautiful angel
FaithfuLee21 says:
the top angel
FaithfuLee21 says:
and he wanted to be God
The Lord says:
Lucifer is a creation of God intended to tempt man, he is a device doing what he was made to do
FaithfuLee21 says:
to dethrown him because he became full of himself
FaithfuLee21 says:
pe
The Lord says:
One of the lost books of the bible
The Lord says:
yup
FaithfuLee21 says:
man created to defeat lucifer
FaithfuLee21 says:
it is our purpose
The Lord says:
What you know of the Devil is just what the Church cut out of the Bible and modified
FaithfuLee21 says:
I don't read "lost books of the bible"
FaithfuLee21 says:
what you k w is what the devil WANTS you to k w
The Lord says:
Of course not, most Christians listed to the entire bible as it is
The Lord says:
*dont listen
The Lord says:
Like stoning unbelievers
The Lord says:
Oh wait, thats iold testimant
FaithfuLee21 says:
I won't listen to things I k w are t truth
The Lord says:
Old Testimant says stone unbelievers that attempt to sway you from god
The Lord says:
But we dont
FaithfuLee21 says:
like that bs about Lillith
FaithfuLee21 says:
being adams first wife
FaithfuLee21 says:
and she bad
FaithfuLee21 says:
so God t rid of her and created eve
The Lord says:
Old Testimant says Gays are abomination
The Lord says:
But they listen to that
FaithfuLee21 says:
God created man and woman to be together t man and man or woman and woman
The Lord says:
So?
FaithfuLee21 says:
you say so
FaithfuLee21 says:
someday you will see why so
The Lord says:
If I make a toaster and it starts picking up Radio signals Im not gonna throw it away
FaithfuLee21 says:
you have great faith
The Lord says:
I have faith in science
FaithfuLee21 says:
and you can t in science AND God?
The Lord says:
Mutually exclusive
FaithfuLee21 says:
many of the greatest scientists ..ones that have come up with our foundational scientific laws ...were Christians
The Lord says:
Christianity requires blind faith, Science requires reproduceable results
The Lord says:
Actually
The Lord says:
Einstien didnt like God
FaithfuLee21 says:
bull
FaithfuLee21 says:
that is incorrect
The Lord says:
nope
FaithfuLee21 says:
you are wrong
FaithfuLee21 says:
again
The Lord says:
A man's ethical behavior should be based effectually on sympathy, education, and social ties and needs; no religious basis is necessary. Man would indeed be in a poor way if he had to be restrained by fear of punishment and hope of reward after death
-Albert Einstien
The Lord says:
I cannot imagine a God who rewards and punishes the objects of his creation, whose purposes are modeled after our own -- a God, in short, who is but a reflection of human frailty. Neither can I believe that the individual survives the death of his body, although feeble souls harbor such thoughts through fear or ridiculous egotisms
-Albert Einstien
The Lord says:
The mystical trend of our time, which shows itself particularly in the rampant growth of the so-called Theosophy and Spiritualism, is for me no more than a symptom of weakness and confusion. Since our inner experiences consist of reproductions, and combinations of sensory impressions, the concept of a soul without a body seem to me to be empty and devoid of meaning
-Albert Einstien
The Lord says:
You want to try me, what I know is fact, not some theological skepticism that can go left or right depending on what you need at the moment
FaithfuLee21 says:
well I ca t believe if I take a piece of mere metal and run it across my hand that it would ever cut me...that just would be cruel....
The Lord says:
and thats just stupid
FaithfuLee21 says:
pe it is perfect in explaining God and why He "punishes and rewards"
FaithfuLee21 says:
it is the way it is
FaithfuLee21 says:
actually HE does t punish
FaithfuLee21 says:
He gives man a choice
FaithfuLee21 says:
they choose punishment or the rewards of heaven
The Lord says:
Do this or your going to suffer
The Lord says:
thats the choice
FaithfuLee21 says:
it is clear
FaithfuLee21 says:
choose
The Lord says:
There shouldnt be a choice
FaithfuLee21 says:
I think I have made the better choice
The Lord says:
God is anti-American
The Lord says:
Thats not freedom at all
FaithfuLee21 says:
lol
The Lord says:
Thats a fascist dictatorship
FaithfuLee21 says:
so in america if you are a pedophile you should be able to out and molest children?
The Lord says:
Follow me or burn
FaithfuLee21 says:
and t be punished?>
The Lord says:
Are pedophiles allowed to molest children in hell?
The Lord says:
No
FaithfuLee21 says:
it is a choice
The Lord says:
Thats a bad example then
FaithfuLee21 says:
it is a choice
FaithfuLee21 says:
it is an example of America punishing for wrong choices
FaithfuLee21 says:
if you do this you will serve the consequence
FaithfuLee21 says:
if you choose t to do this you will t serve the consequences and have your freedom
The Lord says:
its hopeless trying to talk to you on this, heh
The Lord says:
question for you
FaithfuLee21 says:
k
The Lord says:
Is God prone to talking to himself?
FaithfuLee21 says:
what?
The Lord says:
Just answer
FaithfuLee21 says:
I don't think so
FaithfuLee21 says:
I think everything He says is of Great Importance
The Lord says:
Who does he tell to let light be?
FaithfuLee21 says:
it is a statement
FaithfuLee21 says:
and the angels were there then too
The Lord says:
to who?
FaithfuLee21 says:
angels came before earth and everything but God
The Lord says:
Where does it say that?
The Lord says:
In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
FaithfuLee21 says:
if you had infinite power...and all you had to do is speak to make something "be" every word you said would be important
FaithfuLee21 says:
in teh beginning of what we k w
The Lord says:
If hes God he doesnt need to speak to make it happen
FaithfuLee21 says:
lucifer fell before the creation
The Lord says:
it just does
The Lord says:
Impossible
FaithfuLee21 says:
thing is impossible with God
The Lord says:
http://www.pawcreek.org/articles/endtimes/WhenDidSatanFall.htm
FaithfuLee21 says:
lucifer BEFORE ...a heaven dweller with God
FaithfuLee21 says:
he a beautiful..in fact the MOST beautiful angel
FaithfuLee21 says:
the top angel
FaithfuLee21 says:
and he wanted to be God
The Lord says:
Lucifer is a creation of God intended to tempt man, he is a device doing what he was made to do
FaithfuLee21 says:
to dethrown him because he became full of himself
FaithfuLee21 says:
pe
The Lord says:
One of the lost books of the bible
The Lord says:
yup
FaithfuLee21 says:
man created to defeat lucifer
FaithfuLee21 says:
it is our purpose
The Lord says:
What you know of the Devil is just what the Church cut out of the Bible and modified
FaithfuLee21 says:
I don't read "lost books of the bible"
FaithfuLee21 says:
what you k w is what the devil WANTS you to k w
The Lord says:
Of course not, most Christians listed to the entire bible as it is
The Lord says:
*dont listen
The Lord says:
Like stoning unbelievers
The Lord says:
Oh wait, thats iold testimant
FaithfuLee21 says:
I won't listen to things I k w are t truth
The Lord says:
Old Testimant says stone unbelievers that attempt to sway you from god
The Lord says:
But we dont
FaithfuLee21 says:
like that bs about Lillith
FaithfuLee21 says:
being adams first wife
FaithfuLee21 says:
and she bad
FaithfuLee21 says:
so God t rid of her and created eve
The Lord says:
Old Testimant says Gays are abomination
The Lord says:
But they listen to that
FaithfuLee21 says:
God created man and woman to be together t man and man or woman and woman
The Lord says:
So?
FaithfuLee21 says:
you say so
FaithfuLee21 says:
someday you will see why so
The Lord says:
If I make a toaster and it starts picking up Radio signals Im not gonna throw it away
FaithfuLee21 says:
you have great faith
The Lord says:
I have faith in science
FaithfuLee21 says:
and you can t in science AND God?
The Lord says:
Mutually exclusive
FaithfuLee21 says:
many of the greatest scientists ..ones that have come up with our foundational scientific laws ...were Christians
The Lord says:
Christianity requires blind faith, Science requires reproduceable results
The Lord says:
Actually
The Lord says:
Einstien didnt like God
FaithfuLee21 says:
bull
FaithfuLee21 says:
that is incorrect
The Lord says:
nope
FaithfuLee21 says:
you are wrong
FaithfuLee21 says:
again
The Lord says:
A man's ethical behavior should be based effectually on sympathy, education, and social ties and needs; no religious basis is necessary. Man would indeed be in a poor way if he had to be restrained by fear of punishment and hope of reward after death
-Albert Einstien
The Lord says:
I cannot imagine a God who rewards and punishes the objects of his creation, whose purposes are modeled after our own -- a God, in short, who is but a reflection of human frailty. Neither can I believe that the individual survives the death of his body, although feeble souls harbor such thoughts through fear or ridiculous egotisms
-Albert Einstien
The Lord says:
The mystical trend of our time, which shows itself particularly in the rampant growth of the so-called Theosophy and Spiritualism, is for me no more than a symptom of weakness and confusion. Since our inner experiences consist of reproductions, and combinations of sensory impressions, the concept of a soul without a body seem to me to be empty and devoid of meaning
-Albert Einstien
The Lord says:
You want to try me, what I know is fact, not some theological skepticism that can go left or right depending on what you need at the moment
FaithfuLee21 says:
well I ca t believe if I take a piece of mere metal and run it across my hand that it would ever cut me...that just would be cruel....
The Lord says:
and thats just stupid
FaithfuLee21 says:
pe it is perfect in explaining God and why He "punishes and rewards"
FaithfuLee21 says:
it is the way it is
FaithfuLee21 says:
actually HE does t punish
FaithfuLee21 says:
He gives man a choice
FaithfuLee21 says:
they choose punishment or the rewards of heaven
The Lord says:
Do this or your going to suffer
The Lord says:
thats the choice
FaithfuLee21 says:
it is clear
FaithfuLee21 says:
choose
The Lord says:
There shouldnt be a choice
FaithfuLee21 says:
I think I have made the better choice
The Lord says:
God is anti-American
The Lord says:
Thats not freedom at all
FaithfuLee21 says:
lol
The Lord says:
Thats a fascist dictatorship
FaithfuLee21 says:
so in america if you are a pedophile you should be able to out and molest children?
The Lord says:
Follow me or burn
FaithfuLee21 says:
and t be punished?>
The Lord says:
Are pedophiles allowed to molest children in hell?
The Lord says:
No
FaithfuLee21 says:
it is a choice
The Lord says:
Thats a bad example then
FaithfuLee21 says:
it is a choice
FaithfuLee21 says:
it is an example of America punishing for wrong choices
FaithfuLee21 says:
if you do this you will serve the consequence
FaithfuLee21 says:
if you choose t to do this you will t serve the consequences and have your freedom
The Lord says:
its hopeless trying to talk to you on this, heh
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Dis aliter visum. <br>IQ Rating: 140
He's talking to the angels, they were there before creation.
Alternatively he was talking to the other gods (elohim).
Additionally, El and Yahweh weren't originally the same god.
Alternatively he was talking to the other gods (elohim).
Additionally, El and Yahweh weren't originally the same god.
[URL="http://www.starwarsepics.com"]Star Wars Epics[/URL] :: Like Star Wars, but with better dialogue.
Admin - New Republican - VC Magnate - Reasonable Redcoat
Maybe he just liked the sound of his own voice?
If its anything like you hear in the movies, I could understand it.
If its anything like you hear in the movies, I could understand it.
<b>Taj Daemun<br><i>Worship Me</b></i>
You oughta read Incarnations of Immortality Sam, good series and covers that too.
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Admin - New Republican - VC Magnate - Reasonable Redcoat
Oh? sounds interesting.
What is it about? is it actual fiction or a kind of analysis?
What is it about? is it actual fiction or a kind of analysis?
<b>Taj Daemun<br><i>Worship Me</b></i>
The Incarnations of Immortality series by Piers Anthony?
Its listed as Fantasy but its got just as much science in it than any science fiction novel I've read. What throws it into the Fantasy genre is the fact that at somepoint in the book worlds timeline magic was rediscovered and scientificaly verified, and at the time it was, long forgotten magical creatures returned to fore.
So now you have Car companies dealing advertisement wars with Magic Carpet companies. Laws making Dragon Hunting Illegal becuase of too effective Bazoka toting hunters. All sorts of enchantments and spells substituting normal parts of life (I personally enjoyed a rebel battle of Tanks and Jets fighting a group of summoned Flying chinese dragons).
 Del Rey Hardbound Edition 1983, 249 pages.<br />
<br />
In the early 21st century, Zane is living a pathetic life without money or employment. When a magic gem merchant cheats Zane out of an opportunity for romance, Zane decides to take his own life. As he starts to pull the trigger, he sees the spectre of Death (Thanatos) advancing on him. Startled he pulls the gun from his own head and shoots Death right between the eyes. He is then visited by a woman who introduces herself as the incarnation of Fate, and insists that Zane must now assume the position of the man he has killed, since whoever kills Death must become the new Death. As Fate guides Zane downstairs, he gets his first view of a pale limousine with the license plate reading "Mortis".. his Death Steed (Death rides a pale horse) who can assume the form of a black jet boat, a black jet plane, or a black jet car, as well as the form of a horse. Fate then departs and leaves Zane in the care of Chronos who then instructs Zane how to use his deathwatch, How Mortis changes form, how to use other instruments of the office, and exactly what his new duties are. This entails residing in Purgatory and visiting Earth to collect the souls of humans who are in a close balance of good and evil and cannot determine their eternal destination (Heaven or Hell) without help.<br />
<br />
In the course of learning the job, he discovers that his coming into the office of Death was not accidental, but was manipulated by a powerful magician (Cedric Kaftan Jr.). Despite being a mortal, this magician has strong ties to the other Incarnations from Purgatory and reveals to Zane that the Incarnation of Fate arranged Zane's destiny for the magician's purpose. There is a prophecy which states that Luna Kaftan, the magician's daughter, is destined to go into politics and thwart the schemes of Satan, the Incarnation of Evil. Luna Kaftan is thus a target for the forces of Hell and is in need of supernatural protection. The magician, who has done a great deal of research, feels that Zane is the best candidate for the Incarnation of Death to fall in love with Luna and thus want to protect her.<br />
<br />
The only way for the magician Kaftan to meet with Death without Satan's knowledge is to die with his soul in balance. The magician chooses to sacrifice his own life in order to introduce Zane to Luna and explain to Zane the circumstances which brought him into the office of Death.<br />
<br />
The dead magician's plans however seem to go awry. Due to manipulation by Satan, Luna is also destined to die before she can fulfill the prophecy. The magician had used too much black magic for his soul to be in balance. In order to bring it into balance before committing suicide, he has transferred the excess evil on his soul to Luna's soul, whom he has assumed to be innocent of evil. However, Luna has a burden of evil on her soul already, and her father's scheme has put her on the course to Hell. To correct this, she volunteers to switch places with one of Death's other clients. By sacrificing her own life to save another, she manages to balance the evil on her soul.<br />
<br />
Her actions play right into Satan's trap, who doesn't care whether she goes to Heaven or Hell, only that she dies and is no longer a threat to his plots. However, Zane has already fallen in love with Luna by this time, just like the magician had planned, and he refuses to take the soul of the woman he loves.<br />
<br />
Now the motives behind the magician's choice of Zane are made clear to him when the other four Incarnations from Purgatory approach him and explain that they were all in on the plan. The previous Death could not be manipulated into betraying the duties of his office for love, so the Incarnations decided to replace him with a young, stubborn man like Zane, who could.<br />
<br />
Because Luna's soul is next in the queue, Zane cannot take the souls of other mortals until he deals with hers. He refuses to do so, thereby going on strike and leaving dying mortals in agony, unable to be released by death. As this is not to Satan's advantage, he first tries to bribe Zane, then intimidate him into going back to work.<br />
<br />
Zane, however, has had a conversation with Gaea, the Incarnation of Nature, who has demonstrated to him the absolute power each Incarnation wields in its own sphere of influence. Zane eventually realizes that the office of Death is unassailable by Satan and that he cannot be harmed within the sphere of that office. As an Incarnation, Satan himself has a soul and is subject to Zane's dominion. The conflict ends in a draw and Satan has no choice but to admit defeat.<br />
<br />
With Satan's plot exposed, Purgatory changes Luna's destiny and she is free to return to life. Zane lifts his strike, and with Luna under his protection, Satan can no longer interfere with her fate through the means of death.<br />
<br />
Trivia<br />
<br />
* One minor problem with the continuity of the series is that, throughout the rest of the novels, the official title for the Incarnation of Death is Thanatos and everyone recognizes this, both Incarnations, dead souls, supernatural beings, and mortals. However, in this first novel of the series, the title is simply Death, though Gaea (Nature) does call him Thanatos as her own pet name for him.<br />
<br />
<br />
[img]http://www.piers-anthony.com/images/bearinganhourglass-hb-lg.jpg[/img]<br />
<br />
Some time in the future (as evidenced by technology in use that is much more advanced than in the first story), Norton - a man of about forty - is living a life of nomadic wandering when a ghost named Gawain asks him to father a child to his widow, Orlene, with whom Norton eventually falls in love. Gawain then asks Gaea, the Incarnation of Nature, to make the child in his own likeness so his bloodline would continue. Unfortunately, the child ends up dead due to a disease that runs in Gawain's family. Orlene then commits suicide.<br />
<br />
Feeling down about the disastrous results of his affair with Orlene, Norton is approached by Gawain again, who offers Norton the position of Time (Chronos), where he must rule over all Earthly aspects of time. Gawain explains to Norton that Chronos lives backwards in time until the moment of the birth of the office holder's previous self, who is still living forwards. The ghost baits Norton, explaining to him that, by living backwards, he can continue to see Orlene, since she is still alive in the past. Norton accepts, and Gawain leads him to the spot where the future office holder of Time, Norton's predecessor, will pass the hourglass onto Norton.<br />
<br />
Norton immediately starts literally living life backwards in time, though he can temporarily go forward in order to interact with others. However, when he is living backwards, he is not visible to mortals. Norton experiments with his hourglass, recognised by all the Incarnations as being the most powerful magical device in the universe, to halt and/or reverse time, travel many millions of years into the Earth's past, and work with the Incarnation of Fate, who needs his hourglass to help fix tangles in her threads of fate.<br />
<br />
Because Norton lives backwards in time, his past is everyone else's future, making him an isolated character even among the other Incarnations. He also realises that this will make it impossible to have a relationship with the forward-living Orlene. He does, however, have an affair with Clotho, the youngest aspect of Fate. This is both awkward and intriguing to Norton since her past is his future.<br />
<br />
Residing at his new residence in Purgatory, Norton is then visited by Satan, who informs Norton that while he can travel anywhere in time with his hourglass, he can not leave Earth. Satan claims to have the power to travel the whole universe, since evil permeates all of reality, and gives Norton some samples of this ability by having him travel to other planets where Norton gets involved in both a space opera and an epic fantasy adventure. Satan offers Norton the ability to have that power if Norton will grant Satan a favor; to go back in time 20 years and save a man from committing suicide.<br />
<br />
Norton goes back in time to check out this young man, but after consulting with the other Incarnations, he is informed that this man is the current office holder of the Incarnation of Death (Thanatos) and that it is his attempted suicide that brought him to that position. This man is needed as Thanatos in order to protect his girlfriend, Luna Kaftan, from Satan's mischief so she can go into politics and fulfill a prophecy of thwarting Satan.<br />
<br />
However, a relic Satan had given Norton turned out to be a demon in disguise. When Norton went back in time, the demon disembarked a few years in the past to prevent Luna from going into politics (the demon gives an incumbent politician an antidote to keep him alive so Luna doesn't take his place). Due to some of the limitations of the hourglass, intercepting this demon is difficult, but Norton eventually manages to stop it.<br />
<br />
Not giving up, Satan tries one more time by trapping Norton on one of the other planets he had an adventure on. Not sure how to get back home, Norton starts toying with the hourglass, traveling all the way back to the beginning of the known universe and all the way to its end (from the big bang to the point where all matter became trapped in black holes) and realizes that, since in the Incarnations universe magic does not extend beyond Earth, his adventures on other planets were illusions created by Satan, and that Norton had, in fact, never left Earth.<br />
<br />
Norton then finds out that the demon that created the illusion had been attached to him and, once again, disembarked at a point in the past, two years after the events of the first book, to begin a campaign to discredit Luna so she doesn't run for office. Norton then goes back in time to this point and uses his hourglass to show the world all the bad things that will happen if Luna doesn't get elected. As Norton is no longer fooled by Satan's illusions, Satan stops trying to exploit him.<br />
<br />
Trivia<br />
<br />
* During Norton's adventures as Chronos, he is assisted by a snake ring named Sning that knows everything but can only answer yes or no questions with squeezes. While all the Incarnations in these books have someone or something to help assist them, Sning is a unique situation because he is not part of the office but was actually a gift given to him by Orlene.<br />
<br />
[img]http://www.fantasticfiction.co.uk/images/n0/n4899.jpg[/img]<br />
<br />
Set around the time of World War I, a young Irish (around 21-23) woman named Niobe has a marriage arranged for her by her parents. Her husband-to-be is a teenage boy (16-17) named Cedric Kaftan. She considers him too immature for her, but can find no way out of the marriage. Although Niobe at first hates being married to a "child", Cedric's good nature, kind heartedness, and desire to make his wife happy and safe win her over, and she soon falls madly in love with her husband. Cedric shows that he is a prodigy when it comes to magic by easily casting spells that seasoned wizards find difficult if not impossible. With some prodding and nurturing from his wife as well as from his mentor, Cedric accepts a scholarship to attend college and hone his magical abilities. As he matures and finds his niche in magic and wetland studies, he and Niobe have a child.. Cedric Jr. With a bright future certain, and wizardry greatness assured, life in the Kaftan house was happy indeed. Sadly a few years later, Cedric learns of a plot to kill Niobe. Seeing no way to avert it, He leaves school, goes home to Niobe, hastily puts his affairs in order, and sets in motion the only way he can save his wife's life..... by taking her place. On the fateful morning, Cedric wakes up to make love to his wife one last time, kisses her goodbye and goes into the woods to face his destiny. Awakened by gunshots, Niobe learns her husband is assassinated as part of a plot by the agents of Satan. She learns not only of the plot, but that she, and not her husband, was the real target. Upon learning this Niobe's hatred for having her husband's life cut short make her vow to make Satan pay.<br />
<br />
She is invited to join the Incarnation(s) of Fate, three women sharing one physical body. Eager to thwart Satan's plans and to avenge Cedric, she leaves her child with Cedric's cousin and becomes Clotho, the youngest aspect of the three Fates. The three Fates weave the tapestry of life and have disposition over the length of human lives and the pattern they produce. Clotho, the youngest, spins the threads from the substance of Void; Lachesis, the middle aspect, measures the threads and Atropos, the oldest, cuts the thread of each individual human. When she takes the aspect of Clotho, Niobe must journey to the edge of the Void without aid from the other Fates and replenish her stock of thread-material.<br />
<br />
Because Incarnations do not age, Niobe spends many years as Clotho. She frequently visits her son, who has befriended Cedric's younger cousin, Pacian. Because her lack of aging would be noticed, she takes the form of the grandmotherly Atropos, pretending to be a concerned family friend. One day, the Fates take the two boys to a fortune teller, who gives them disturbing news -- each of the boys will have a daughter who will oppose a tangle in the threads of life. However, one of the girls is fated to marry Death, and the other is fated to marry Evil.<br />
<br />
Niobe leaves the office of Clotho and returns to mortal life in order to marry Pacian, who has matured while she was in office. She gives birth to a daughter they call Orb, at around the same time that her son, who is now a powerful magician, has a daughter called Luna. The two girls grow up together under the magician's protection. At one point the girls and Niobe go on a quest for powerful artifacts that will enhance their natural talents, and Satan takes the opportunity to send demons against them. Although one of the girls is to marry him, he is not interested in a wife who is not evil. Niobe helps the girls to get through safely, though, and Satan's plot comes to nothing.<br />
<br />
One year after the events of On a Pale Horse, the middle-aged Niobe is asked to join the Incarnation of Fate once again, this time as Lachesis. Satan has arranged to have all three women leave the office at the same time, thus making the Incarnation of Fate inexperienced in all three aspects simultaneously. The current office-holders hope to use Niobe's previous experience as aspect of Fate as an ace in the hole to prevent Satan's current plot from coming to fruition.<br />
<br />
They learn that Satan plans to cause political turmoil in the UN by having one of his minions plant a stink-bomb. They are forced to waste time by investigating the likely minions one by one, but in the meantime Satan is offering aging political candidates a chance at eternal youth in exchange for their resignation from office. He plans to replace them with his own minions, who would work against Luna. The three Fates realize that their inexperience is a liability, so they seek help. They learn that Niobe's son, the magician, can help them -- unfortunately, he is now in Hell. Satan cannot prevent them from searching for the magician, but he can make the quest very unpleasant and one of them must risk her own soul in the process. Niobe is worried that Satan will cheat, so she arranges for the Incarnation of War to supervise the contest.<br />
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Niobe leaves the Fates' collective body and goes to Hell. She must beat Satan's challenge - a puzzle-maze - in order to get the answers she is looking for. At the end, she finds her son, but Satan has cast an illusion over him. She puzzles out the answer anyway -- that Satan's plot can be stopped by the Atropos aspect of Fate. Atropos can cut short the lives of Satan's minions, making his plot futile. Niobe wins the game and is allowed to leave Hell freely.<br />
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[img]http://www.piers-anthony.com/images/wieldingaredsword-hb-sm.jpg[/img]<br />
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Mym, an Indian prince, defies his father's plans for an arranged marriage, instead joining a travelling circus. He meets Orb, who teaches him to overcome his own handicap of a terrible stutter through song. He is soon discovered, and his father arranges for him to marry a princess by the name of Rapture. After fighting against this for days on end, he finally realizes that Rapture is worth loving, and so concedes to the marriage. However, a plot to separate him from her results in his decision to become the incarnation of War.<br />
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Through the course of living as Mars, Rapture takes up a life of her own and decides that she doesn't need him anymore. Satan arranges, subtly, a demoness for his new companion, hoping to get Mars in his debt that way. In the end, this backfires and he ends up with two loves in his life.<br />
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His ultimate goal was to use his position to ameliorate some of the suffering being caused by war on Earth, and is surprised by Satan's encouragement. Soon he realizes the subtle importances of human war and conflict: under certain circumstances, human suffering is increased, not decreased, by abstinence from armed response. Satan's plan is to have an inexperienced office-holder in the position of the Incarnation of War, such that he can manipulate the course of armed conflicts on Earth, allowing some wars through and blocking the progression of others, such that the overall balance of evil in the world is increased.<br />
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He accomplished the replacement of the previous Mars by facilitating the cessation of war in the world -- every time this happens in history, the Incarnation of War retires and passes on into the afterlife. Mym stepped into the office at a time when global violence was just being recommenced, and thus became an opportunity for Satan to manipulate a naive Mars.<br />
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Part of this process was a plot by which Satan managed to trap Mym in Hell. Mym eventually led a revolution of the lost souls and secured an escape route, employing lessons from Miyamoto Mushashi's famous treatise, the Book of Five Rings, to defeat Satan in a one-on-one battle. However, during his absence, Satan has manipulated the geopolitical situation such that international tensions everywhere are at an all-time high, and the world is on the brink of apocalypse.<br />
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This results in virtually every government everywhere adopting martial law, as normal democratic process is eminently non-viable. A result of this, and an important objective for Satan, is that Luna Kaftan has become sidelined, unable to fulfill the prophecy that she would rise into political office and stand as a bulwark against Satan.<br />
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Mym realizes Satan's underlying objective, and forces a confrontation on terms unfavourable to Satan -- he travels to the Armaggeddon Clock, a signifier of how close the world is at any given time to Armaggeddon, and there employs the powers specific to his office to escalate world violence and bring War to ultimate fruition.<br />
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The crux is this: that Satan is not yet ready for the Final Judgement to happen, as the current balance of souls on Earth is favourable to God -- i.e. God would get a greater proportion of the souls, signifying (in this fictional universe) the ultimate victory of Good. At the very last minute, Satan is forced to conceded and withdraw. Mym lowers his Sword and returns the world to a state of relative peace.<br />
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Mym learns that his resposibility as War is not to promote war and violence, but to make sure that conflicts are handled fairly.<br />
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Trivia<br />
<br />
While every other incarnation is called by their Greek name (Thanatos, Chronos, Gaea, Atropos/Lachesis/Clotho), the incarnation of War is consistently named Mars, who is the Roman god of war, rather than Ares, the Greek equivalent.<br />
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<img src="http://www.piers-anthony.com/images/beinggreenmother-small.jpg"<br />
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It is discovered that young Orb, the cousin of Luna, has the gift of conjuring natural music that emanates from things in nature. She sets off on a quest for a magical song known as the Llano, a song supposed to be the most beautiful imaginable. During the beginning of her search, she meets and helps a young gypsy girl who was blind, teaching her song and dance as such most men never see. She also joins up with a circus for a short time, meeting there the man that would later become War, and realizing after his unwanted departure that she is pregnant with his child. Upon having his child, she takes the baby, the young Orlene, to her gypsy friend with the understanding that the woman would find her daughter the best possible home.<br />
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Later on, she joins up with a rock and roll band. Her magical singing allows them to lose their drug addictions, and they quest together until she is approached by her grandmother, Niobe, in the guise of Fate. She is told that she has been selected to fill the role of Nature (Gaea), but that a prophecy foretells that she may one day be married to Satan.<br />
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Satan, attempting to fulfill the prophecy, kidnaps Orb and attempts to use magic to compel Orb to marry him. She frees herself with the help of Natasha, a man who has also been seeking the Llano and has learned much of it. Natasha continues to teach her the Llano as they defend themselves from Satan's attacks. Orb learns that the Llano has the power to control Nature and that she must learn it in order to assume her position. She also finds herself falling in love with Natasha and decides to marry him.<br />
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All is not as it seems, however, as Natasha reveals that He is Satan in disguise ("Natasha" is "Ah, Satan" backwards) and He has been attempting to court her according to the terms of an agreement He made with Fate: He will be allowed to court Orb without interference from the other Incarnations, but everything He says to Orb must be a lie, or part of a greater construct of lies, until He proposes marriage, when He must reveal the truth.<br />
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Orb rejects Satan's proposal, and demands that He teach her the final part of the Llano, the Song of Chaos, which she needs to become Gaea. He does so, but warns her that it is a powerful weapon and its effects are unpredictable. She sings the Song of Chaos and it results in devastation on a global scale. Satan then tells her that the only thing that He knows that might reverse its effects is the Song of Chaos itself. She tries singing the song three more times, and each time only results in more destruction. The destruction came in the form of the four elements - Fire, Air, Earth, and Water - so if she sings the song a fifth time, it would appear in the form of the fifth element, Void, and erase the Earth from existence, returning all of existence to primeval Chaos. Thus, the Song of Chaos is Gaea's ultimate weapon; it will unmake all of reality, and Heaven, Hell and the mortal universe will return to the fundamental chaos from which they sprang.<br />
<br />
Desperate, she turns to the other Incarnations for help. Chronos tells her that he can go back in time and stop her from singing the Song of Chaos, but he needs the consent of all the other incarnations in order to do it. The only one who objects is Satan, who says that He will only give his consent if Orb agrees to marry him. Orb, faced with the impossible choice hinted at in the prophecy, declares "God help me, but I do love Satan" and agrees to the wedding.<br />
<br />
Chronos changes the past, and Orb honors her agreement. The wedding takes place in Hell, and Satan puts on a grand ceremony. As their wedding vows, the two each sing a song to the other. Orb sings a section of the Llano (the Song of Evening - also known as the Song of Love) which is meant to evoke romantic love, but Satan, surprising everyone, sings a variation of the hymn Amazing Grace - and vanishes. Singing a song forbidden to Him, Satan abdicates as the Incarnation of Evil as a demonstration of His feelings for Orb. Having fallen in love with a good woman, Satan can no longer continue to hold the office of the Incarnation of Evil.<br />
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[img]http://lookinside2-images.amazon.com/Qffs+v35lepJlcsl2mRLjyBDlQjv9A6we7/RV+9PUasgFaC0Qwzl/4GZ7mgqWk8+[/img]<br />
<br />
Parry, an orphan, is taken in and is accidentally adopted by a wizard who teaches him the benefits of white magic and how it can be used to help others. A musician and adept white magician, Parry plans on following in his father's footsteps when he is encouraged by his father, the sorcerer, to take a bride. Parry selects Jolie, seeing her potential despite her ragged appearance. Using his unique singing talents, Parry convinces Jolie that he means no harm. Taking her in, Parry and his father begin to teach Jolie the ways of wizardry and they begin to fall in love. With his father's blessing, Parry and Jolie wed and are about to start a life of bliss when they are attacked by crusaders of Christianity. Parry's father is killed in the attack and he and Jolie shape shift to birds to escape. Sadly, before they can make it to safety, Jolie is shot through the heart, and once they regain human form, Parry watches as his wife dies in his arms. Vowing vengeance, Parry thinks the best way to escape from the villagers is to hide in plain sight, so he joins a monastery for sanctuary as well as a means to destroy the enemy from within. Soon after joining the Franciscan monks, Parry discovers that a new order, the Dominicans, are being formed with the express purpose of rooting out evil and heresy. Because of his keen mind and magical prowess (which he uses in secrecy), he becomes a feared inquisitor. During one of his many trips to stop Lucifer's campaign of Evil, Parry succumbs to the temptation of his ghostly wife Jolie inhabiting a physical body, thus violating his oath of celibacy.<br />
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As retribution, Lucifer sends forth Lilah (alternately known as Lilith), a demoness, to corrupt him. By using the toehold of his broken oath of celibacy and his own feelings of sexual desire and guilt, Lilah corrupts Parry to Evil. His intense desire for Lilah eventually leads him to corrupt the Inquisition itself. Upon his deathbed, Lucifer attacks Lilah; with his last vestige of strength, Parry manages a surprise attack against Lucifer, saving Lilah. Lucifer, taken off guard, succumbs. As a severely weakened Parry lays dying with only moments to live, Lilah tells him to claim the office before it finds Lucifer's successor, as well as to name the age he would like to assume (he chooses 25). Parry, not understanding what she's asking of him and wanting to honor this last wish before he succumbs to death, does as Lilah requests, and is suddenly transformed into the new Incarnation of Evil and takes the name Satan.<br />
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It is then explained that if no one claims the office, the office seeks out the most qualified person for that position. So if Parry hadn't claimed the office as Lilah had told him, it would have found the most evil person on earth to take Lucifer's place.<br />
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In "For Love of Evil", several scenes from the previous books (as is the case with all the books in the series with respect to their incarnations) are shown from Parry's point of view. Parry also does not believe himself to be evil, but is simply fulfilling his function as an Incarnation.<br />
<br />
It is rather ironic that Parry is not actually evil, he merely wishes to find a way to better facilitate separating good people from bad by using temptation. In fact, in the universe of "Incarnations of Immortality" Parry, as a personal favor to Yahweh, takes steps to prevent the Holocaust from happening.<br />
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Upon taking office, Parry approached the other Incarnations in good faith, but was rebuffed and/or humiliated by them, since they assumed being the incarnation of evil he was naturally their adversary. Of them all, only Chronos offered friendship. This led to his enmity with many of their successors, though his friendship with Chronos and his various predecessors lasts for centuries until His manner of unmaking the Holocaust brings it to an end.<br />
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He also attempted to meet with the Incarnation of Good to find out how to best sort out which souls belonged in Heaven and which in Hell (Parry had no desire for souls that didn't belong in Hell to be there), but was not successful. The Incarnation of Good was too busy contemplating his own greatness to pay any attention (and in the novel "And Eternity" was voted out of office and replaced by mutual agreement of the other six Incarnations).<br />
<br />
It was also discovered that Lucifer, not Satan, ordered Cedric Kaftan killed.<br />
<br />
[img]http://www.fantasticfiction.co.uk/images/n0/n4816.jpg)
In the seventh novel of the series, three women - the ghost of Jolie, the ghost of Orlene (daughter of Orb), and a fourteen-year-old drug-addicted prostitute named Vita - try to discover a way to restore the life of Orlene's baby, who had died as a result of a severe birth defect. Nox, the mysterious Incarnation of Night, promises to help, but she needs a specific item of great value from each of the other Incarnations in order to resurrect the baby. The three women set out to meet with each other Incarnation.
In the process of obtaining the items, they conclude that the definitions of Good and Evil used to classify souls as destined for Heaven and Hell are flawed. Orlene's soul had been denied access to Heaven because she committed suicide in a futile attempt to help her baby. Vita meets and comes under the protection of an older male judge; they fall in love and have sex, but this too is considered Evil, because Vita is below the legal age of consent. The three women eventually succeed in gaining the item from each one of the Incarnations, with the exception of God, the Incarnation of Good, who has become obsessed with his own greatness and is completely unresponsive to the outside world.
Reporting their discovery to the other Incarnations, they all conclude that God has been derelict in his duty and must be replaced so that the eventual triumph of Evil can be prevented. Luna Kaftan, now an influential Senator, begins a campaign to impeach God and declare the office of the Incarnation of Good vacant. Thus, the final conflict between Good and Evil becomes a political one, fought with words and votes in the halls of a legislature, and not by armies on a battlefield. Despite Satan's efforts, Luna's campaign succeeds, and a mortal must now be chosen to become the new Incarnation of Good. However, the replacement must be selected by a unanimous vote of all the other Incarnations, including Satan himself - and why would the Incarnation of Evil approve a candidate who would effectively promote the cause of Good? Each incarnation, in turn, nominates a mortal for the position. (Gaea's nominee happens to be the same judge that became Vita's lover.) After all the other Incarnations make their suggestions, to their complete amazement, Satan nominates Orlene, whose soul had become exactly half evil as a result of choices none of the other Incarnations were willing to condemn. The other Incarnations immediately agree that Satan has made the best possible choice, and they unanimously delare Orlene to be the new Incarnation of Good.
Themes
Incarnations uses its premise to ponder questions regarding the nature of life. As each character goes from a mortal life to the "office" of an Incarnation, they are forced to contemplate their actions on a daily basis. Each incarnation may use their office, within limits, as they see fit. This system humanizes what would otherwise be impersonal forces, leading to both extensive considerations of the effects of the incarnation's work and the impact it has on humans.
Another humorous side of Incarnations is the portrayed magic/technology duality. Most series emphasize one or the other means of understanding and manipulating the world, but in Incarnations each method is equal in usefulness and respect. This leads to a number of amusing parallels, such as competition between automobile and magic-carpet manufacturers. By the future time period of Norton, magic is referred to as the Fifth Fundamental Force, with its own primary particle, the Magicon (similar to a graviton).
A third theme of Incarnations is the multigenerational human story between the Incarnations. Previous characters repeatedly appear in later novels, and by the final novel, every major character is related by blood, marriage, or affair.
Its listed as Fantasy but its got just as much science in it than any science fiction novel I've read. What throws it into the Fantasy genre is the fact that at somepoint in the book worlds timeline magic was rediscovered and scientificaly verified, and at the time it was, long forgotten magical creatures returned to fore.
So now you have Car companies dealing advertisement wars with Magic Carpet companies. Laws making Dragon Hunting Illegal becuase of too effective Bazoka toting hunters. All sorts of enchantments and spells substituting normal parts of life (I personally enjoyed a rebel battle of Tanks and Jets fighting a group of summoned Flying chinese dragons).
In the seventh novel of the series, three women - the ghost of Jolie, the ghost of Orlene (daughter of Orb), and a fourteen-year-old drug-addicted prostitute named Vita - try to discover a way to restore the life of Orlene's baby, who had died as a result of a severe birth defect. Nox, the mysterious Incarnation of Night, promises to help, but she needs a specific item of great value from each of the other Incarnations in order to resurrect the baby. The three women set out to meet with each other Incarnation.
In the process of obtaining the items, they conclude that the definitions of Good and Evil used to classify souls as destined for Heaven and Hell are flawed. Orlene's soul had been denied access to Heaven because she committed suicide in a futile attempt to help her baby. Vita meets and comes under the protection of an older male judge; they fall in love and have sex, but this too is considered Evil, because Vita is below the legal age of consent. The three women eventually succeed in gaining the item from each one of the Incarnations, with the exception of God, the Incarnation of Good, who has become obsessed with his own greatness and is completely unresponsive to the outside world.
Reporting their discovery to the other Incarnations, they all conclude that God has been derelict in his duty and must be replaced so that the eventual triumph of Evil can be prevented. Luna Kaftan, now an influential Senator, begins a campaign to impeach God and declare the office of the Incarnation of Good vacant. Thus, the final conflict between Good and Evil becomes a political one, fought with words and votes in the halls of a legislature, and not by armies on a battlefield. Despite Satan's efforts, Luna's campaign succeeds, and a mortal must now be chosen to become the new Incarnation of Good. However, the replacement must be selected by a unanimous vote of all the other Incarnations, including Satan himself - and why would the Incarnation of Evil approve a candidate who would effectively promote the cause of Good? Each incarnation, in turn, nominates a mortal for the position. (Gaea's nominee happens to be the same judge that became Vita's lover.) After all the other Incarnations make their suggestions, to their complete amazement, Satan nominates Orlene, whose soul had become exactly half evil as a result of choices none of the other Incarnations were willing to condemn. The other Incarnations immediately agree that Satan has made the best possible choice, and they unanimously delare Orlene to be the new Incarnation of Good.
Themes
Incarnations uses its premise to ponder questions regarding the nature of life. As each character goes from a mortal life to the "office" of an Incarnation, they are forced to contemplate their actions on a daily basis. Each incarnation may use their office, within limits, as they see fit. This system humanizes what would otherwise be impersonal forces, leading to both extensive considerations of the effects of the incarnation's work and the impact it has on humans.
Another humorous side of Incarnations is the portrayed magic/technology duality. Most series emphasize one or the other means of understanding and manipulating the world, but in Incarnations each method is equal in usefulness and respect. This leads to a number of amusing parallels, such as competition between automobile and magic-carpet manufacturers. By the future time period of Norton, magic is referred to as the Fifth Fundamental Force, with its own primary particle, the Magicon (similar to a graviton).
A third theme of Incarnations is the multigenerational human story between the Incarnations. Previous characters repeatedly appear in later novels, and by the final novel, every major character is related by blood, marriage, or affair.
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