If some guy is born with a desire for other guys, and he claims to be a Christian, I will expect him to contain himself.But luckily you don't expect the same of yourself. Because that would just be unfair.
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friend of the sleeping pill
Blink If You Can Hear Me
Master Ahnk:
By the way, Gash found this board and now so have I, it's a source of much amusement and tunnel vision propoganda.
http://p202.ezboard.com/brepublicanmight
Enjoy.
By the way, this is from the Site Rules:
Can I debate Jekarinu?
No. That is not fair. I have studied American Politics for several years and have not lost a debate in any feild. Its to lopsided but you can debate other members of the board.
OS: In a world of bon-bons, you are a twinkie.
Ahnk: God damn you, I am Count Chocula and you know it.
I'm not spending my anniversary night thumping my head against the wall. - Damalis, on Moderating TRF
Then tell him you want it harder, damnit! - Ahnk, on Damalis
Return of the King of the Cafe!
...Uh... weird.
The House Detective
Theren Gevel:
But luckily you don't expect the same of yourself. Because that would just be unfair.
Explain?
Astral Astoria Moderator.
Jedi Masterwan ... ... Shaken, Not Stirred
Thank you, gash.
Bananas
defy the tyrannous stars
So until you become a Christian, while I will explain my beliefs, and debate should you want it, I won't try un-gay you for religious reasons before I un-heathen you.
Fair play to you. So long as you're not shoving it down my throat, it's a-okay!
Blink If You Can Hear Me
Vega:
Fair play to you. So long as you're not shoving it down my throat, it's a-okay!
I thought you liked it when I shoved it down your throat?
OS: In a world of bon-bons, you are a twinkie.
Ahnk: God damn you, I am Count Chocula and you know it.
I'm not spending my anniversary night thumping my head against the wall. - Damalis, on Moderating TRF
Then tell him you want it harder, damnit! - Ahnk, on Damalis
Return of the King of the Cafe!
A.J. Michalson:Yeah, well, there's a problem there, y'know. There's conflict. The conflict being, that you want to convert people and once converted convince them not to be gay. Thus you don't want people to be gay, but you want them to be christian first before you work on the gay part. And if you (or the church, or a bunch of priests, or whatever group/individual you can name) feel that these are wrong soely on an idealogical basis, and want to change other peoples' beliefs so that they are 'right' in your beliefs, even if you believe your beliefs are right because they are confirmed by what you believe to be a perfect source (God, Pope, whatever), there is a conflict.
My dislike of homosexuality is directly tied to my religious beliefs. If you don't believe like I do, then it's going to be pretty hard for you to understand.
I equate it to this: I am cursed with a wandering eye. I think all guys know what I'm talking about; I'm forever 'checking out' the girls I see. Even though I am committed to abstinence until marriage, I still have to deal with the instincts I was born with. I have to constantly tell myself "Look at her eyes, burn you!".
If some guy is born with a desire for other guys, and he claims to be a Christian, I will expect him to contain himself. I even believe that God can remove that desire should the man ask. I do not, however, believe that people who are not Christians should be governed by my moral values. I will do my best to convert them, and then help them work on the problems they have in their life (be it addiction, vices, sex, etc).
I believe homosexuality is a sin, and is something to be dealt with. But it can only be dealt with if the person doing the sin knows (or claims to know) God. Otherwise, it's just wasted breath on my part.
So until you become a Christian, while I will explain my beliefs, and debate should you want it, I won't try un-gay you for religious reasons before I un-heathen you.
The exception to this would be, just for instance, if it popped up that having 'sex with multiple partners in a lot of kinky ways' (replace quoted words with whatever the topic of the moment is) aided in the spread of some deadly disease that kills hundreds of millions of innocent people per year...
It is not, I believe, right to push beliefs on others. You should not try to change people soely for their idealogical beliefs. If your only reason for not liking homosexuality is that your religion does not like it, and you are trying to change others to fit it, then that is (I can safely say) Unjust. Of course, if someones' beliefs come into a real and material conflict with you in some way (if someone believed it was ok to rip heads off of passer-byes, for example) then obviously you must either intervene or compromise.
The House Detective
Vega:Originally, when my name came up as a potential moderator (this was a year and a half ago), one or two staff members expressed concern that I might try use the position to force my religious and moral beliefs upon other members.
Fair play to you. So long as you're not shoving it down my throat, it's a-okay!
I believe I have not done any of that. Sure, I'll heat up in a debate just like anyone else, but I have yet to ban you because you don't kneel and pray to Jesus seven times a day.
Not sure if that's what you meant, though.
Dolash:It's not an ideological thing, it's where I believe I know how to live forever, and I want everyone else to live forever too.
Yeah, well, there's a problem there, y'know. There's conflict. The conflict being, that you want to convert people and once converted convince them not to be gay. Thus you don't want people to be gay, but you want them to be christian first before you work on the gay part. And if you (or the church, or a bunch of priests, or whatever group/individual you can name) feel that these are wrong soely on an idealogical basis, and want to change other peoples' beliefs so that they are 'right' in your beliefs, even if you believe your beliefs are right because they are confirmed by what you believe to be a perfect source (God, Pope, whatever), there is a conflict.
It is not, I believe, right to push beliefs on others. You should not try to change people soely for their idealogical beliefs. If your only reason for not liking homosexuality is that your religion does not like it, and you are trying to change others to fit it, then that is (I can safely say) Unjust. Of course, if someones' beliefs come into a real and material conflict with you in some way (if someone believed it was ok to rip heads off of passer-byes, for example) then obviously you must either intervene or compromise.
I try convert people because I believe they are drowning, and I have a life raft. If, after I through you the life raft you refuse it, I will back off. Occasionally I may motion toward the life raft, or make mention to it, but if you're not remotely interested in getting on, I'm not going to pull out a shotgun and make you get on.
Astral Astoria Moderator.
defy the tyrannous stars
Not sure if that's what you meant, though.
I just mean that, in the end, I'm fine with people (read: Christians) having it in for homosexuality. Everyone has things that they don't approve of and that's fine, so long as you don't force your beliefs on other people - which I'm not saying you are, but rather commending you for doing otherwise. It's fine to suggest, so long as you reach the point where you realize that your suggestions aren't wanted and stop. Where it becomes a problem is when people decide to carry on regardless.
Also, I like your life raft metaphor
